The “Water Cooler” is a feature on Claycord.com where we ask you a question or provide a topic, and you talk about it.
The “Water Cooler” will be up Monday-Friday at noon.
Today’s question:
QUESTION: Do you think the entire country should be under a “shelter-at-home” order in an effort to stop the spread of the coronavirus?
Talk about it.
Yes – we either all do it for 30 days or it seems pointless as it will continue to resurface in smaller areas (not sheltered) and keep spreading as we approach summer
My answer to the question is ‘Yes’ and Jeff is correct, we all should do it for 30 days to stop the virus from spreading; otherwise, it will eventually work it’s way back and continue spreading.
No, let the local jurisdiction make that decision.
Agree, it should be where there are outbreaks.
I don’t see the point if it has no effect (where the virus does not exist). Somehow the economy must be factored into decisions. We can’t shut everything down for a year. We don’t want to overwhelm the hospitals but we also don’t want to harm our ability to survive economically. Where is the right balance point? That is the question.
Are we going overboard with shelter at home when other means of social distancing and sanitation could be just as effective? Will we hit a point where people simply can’t stay at home any longer and then we lose control?
There is no balance point. Survival will also trump the economy.
Should be: “Survival will ALWAYS trump the economy.”
I would leave it to the states to implement with input from the Federal Government.
There was a little less traffic this morning which is always a welcoming sight, but the stores were as busy as always. I see people who think they are taking precautions by wearing masks and trying to stay 6 feet away from others, then they go and scratch their face after touching a dirty shopping cart.
Contra Costa County has already issued a shelter in place and the only people it’s affecting are the business owners and employees who are losing money. Unemployment insurance only pays about 60% of what people were making at their jobs, and even with the $1200 the feds want to pay out, it isn’t enough to cover expenses for a small business owner when they not only have to pay the rent for their business, but also pay their mortgage or rent for their home.
I predict we will be seeing a lot of people filing for bankruptcy soon.
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No! And Hell no. When did it become ok to give up our civil liberties! This at the cost of our country?
California should not be on a lockdown, Our governor has no idea what he is doing?
Yes he does. He is looking at Italy and Spain. Your civil liberties are not taking away they might be put on a temporarily hold. I also have civil liberties and I would prefer not to be infected with this virus.
Don’t know your age, if you had been alive after Dec.7 1941 and the I believe the west coast was ordered to have black curtains so in case the Japanese decided to bomb us they could not see any light, you would not have obeyed? I know in Denmark during the occupation all of the country was ordered go “black” at night, it was for the country’s own good.
I trust the American’s to have common sense and take this seriously,
everyone’s civil liberties and free speech and other freedoms is still in the constitution, no one is altering that, when they do, you, I and everyone can start to worry.
@ Hanne Jeppesen
Since you mention WWII, I would suppose that you would support rounding up all those infected with COVID – 19 and putting them into internment camps too? That was sold as being good for the country; however, it was later determined by the SCOTUS to be a violation of the Constitution. A ruling that FDR willfully ignored.
The fact that I have been ordered by the Government under penalty of arrest and imprisonment to stay in my home clear shows that my civil liberties and free speech and other freedoms have IN FACT been altered. The question is for how long.
If you are not at least a little concerned about being, what is essentially under house arrest, you don’t deserve the freedoms you have… and you may not have them for long.
Well said Carnac!
There are exceptions to every rule.
That kind of rumor has been floating around lately.
It is just an unfounded rumor.
The first problem they would have is food. There’s not enough food now for everyone because of panic buying, announcing something like this and there would be none for the majority of the people.
It’s unenforceable. There are not enough National Guard troops and they are armed but without bullets.
People who love freedom would be protesting. Government changing type protests.
The panic would be the worst of it. Stores would be broken into and ransacked. I believe there would be a complete breakdown of the law.
I don’t expect anything like a national lockdown to happen.
It’s bad enough that CA is attempting to do so but I think it’s failing.
No of course I don’t support everyone being rounded up, I just think people can act like mature adults and do what is best for them and those around them. Nowhere have I seen anything about arresting anyone, and I understand what a fiasco is was to put the Japanese in internment camps, not a good mark for FDR, on that particular issue.
You are expressing yourself in this forum so it seems to me you still have freedom of speech.
@ Hanne Jeppesen
Is there some reason why you post your response to my rebuttal in the wrong location?
Newsom and the Director of Public Heath for Contra Costa County have effectually suspended the 1st Amendment of the Bill of Rights by ordering, not asking, but ordering everyone to “shelter in place”. Another way to say it is “house arrest”. They are enforcing their order with the threat of arrest. The punishment is by both fine and/or imprisonment. Just because you haven’t heard of it being enforced with arrest doesn’t mean that it cannot be enforced with arrest.
Compliance by threats of arrest from the government is not voluntary. It is the very definition of coercion.
To quote your post, “everyone’s civil liberties and free speech and other freedoms”. Nice how you pick and chose which civil liberty you chose to point out I still possess….free speech.. on an internet blog …with a fictitious name. Anonymity on the internet is hardly proof of free speech. Saying something unpopular in the public square AND BEING ALLOWED TO DO SO is the definition of free speech.
The 1st Amendment covers not only free speech, religion and a free press but the right to peaceably to assemble. I am being prevented for peaceably assembling by order of my government under pain of arrest and imprisonment.
If I were to show up to my local police department with 30 of my friends and we refuse to leave and shelter in place what do you suppose would happen to us? Would I still enjoy my right to peaceable assemble and free speech or would we be rounded up and concentrated in county jail?
This suspension of the Bill of Rights for 2 weeks is underrepresented in modern American history and you act like it’s not big deal. Not even concerned about it.
I shutter to think what your opinion will be on martial law.
No, that is too blunt of an instrument. We should ramp up testing capacities using every means possible so we can know how strict the measures should be in different places. There’s no point killing more businesses in areas where the spread hasn’t yet reached. Prevention isn’t the only thing at stake here: we are looking at economic devastation that will have its own bad health effects.
THIS!
All of this is almost meaningless without massive testing
The fact we don’t have it yet is a gross failure of our government ion every level
Carnac The reason my replies are in the wrong place, is if I don’t see the word reply right under your post, I go to the nearest reply I see, don’t know how else to do it, could be due to my lack of computer skills.
I certainly am not for martial law. I think the difference here is that I think the politicians are doing what they think is best and will protect us, you on the other hand see some nefarious plot, designed to take your freedoms away permanently. Call me naïve, but I just don’t think most of our elected officials are that cunning and evil, including Trump.
Yes. If it prevents the spread & people follow it then absolutely.
Unless we do it everywhere, it will keep popping up and we will have to delay all over again. We can’t stop people moving about so the whole country needs to shut it down for three to four weeks.
Exactly. What good is isolation if others are not isolated? We have to think smart and act smart.
Beside the virus we are playing with financial fire. We have a pill that if you take in time, that is before you need a respirator, you will be cured. My suggestion is we all go back to work and school. If you feel ill take the test, then the pill if needed and stay home. If you are an old dude in not great shape stay home. Everyone else get on with iliving. If this stay at home order is kept up for six months we are done.
There is no cure. Stop posting that. It’s false and dangerous
Yogurt, do you have absolute trust in our Government?
No I don’t but What does have to do with there not being a cure?
So, there is no way you can be sure if there is or is not a cure…..
You’re easy pickin’s Pop!
Neither Trump or Dr. Anthony Fauci have said there is a cure. They are hopeful, but there have been no clinical trials. Bottom line, there is no known cure available today.
Yes, of course.
The question is simple – do we want to try and bend the curve of what is coming or not?
IMHO – if the decision is to be made at the state level – any state that does not do it should be excluded from any taxpayer help. Let them deal with it on their own.
If the taxpayers in those states don’t like it – they should tell their leadership to get with the program.
I agree Rob. On the flip side any state that institutes a shutdown should receive no federal help.
No expanded unemployment insurance.
No Navy Medical ship.
No Family leave act.
Pay your taxes on April 15th no extension.
No big business bail outs that are head quartered in the state.
No local and city government grants.
No free test kits.
No welfare
Etc…etc……
As far as a nation wide shut down. No.
We sure could use the billions of dollars that my fellow California voters pissed away on the choo choo train right about now.
I have heard from a few friends and family in my native Denmark that the whole country is shut down, of course we are only about 5 million people, and the government don’t have to deal with the states rights issue. Also most Europeans are not as suspicious of the government as many American’s seems to be. From what I can gather it would probably be best if everyone was on the same page, but don’t know if it is realistic.
Americans are independent and question authority unlike the European sheep who do everything their government tells them to do without questioning.
Hanne, our founding fathers were distrustful of government. It’s baked into the cake, and goes a long way in preserving our liberty.
No. Essential services are still going on, this means a lot of people are still out and about, literally 10000’s of people are still out there.
No. Nobody, except maybe the diehard prepper, has enough food and basic necessities to survive for 30 days.
No. WIthout drastic financial support, many self employed independent contractors will simply go out of business. When they do, rent/mortgage is not paid. Do you really expect the owners/banks to just accept that they will not receive the money? Why are they expected to cover the cost of this?
We need to find a balance.
We need HONEST news.
We need to hear about those that have recovered. The worldometer site says that 90,605 have recovered out of the 271,598 cases that were reported. I am not sure if this site has accurate information, but there is value in reporting that information.
Locking people in homes, threats of Martial Law (thanks gov for scaring people!!!!), does not help us! Locking us up will do more harm in the long run.
ZZ That is just not true, Scandinavian’s are very independent, and certainly everyone has some critic of their government, let’s say we are not as suspicious of government as some American’s are. As far as I can tell at least from the 2 countries I know most about Denmark and Sweden, the politicians are more honest and American politicians.
I find it curious that it seems those who are gets upset when I’m being critical of Trump or American are some of the same who has the most distrust of government.
Just to make it clear I have lived in the US since the late sixties, and consider the US my adopted country, I love the US, I love Americans, they are independent, innovative, quiet open (especially compared to Scandinavians, although the Danes are consider they more open and fun loving of the 5 Scandinavians countries) and generous people, doesn’t mean I have to agree with all of them.
@hannejeppsen, You’re straddling two countries at once. You’re beholden to Denmark, yet live here. You really don’t know America’s laws or history, just bits and pieces of it. And you just don’t “get” Americans, and you never will.
Having a perspective other than native born is interesting to me, and I haven’t found Hanne to be unfair in her observations and criticisms. “Getting” Americans and our customs isn’t hard, we are the most open society of any that come to mind. Heck our culture is among our major exports for good or bad. Keep rocking it Frau Jeppesen, let the haters hate, they we’re gonna do that anyway. 👊
Gee ZZ, you sure do assume to know a lot about Hanne.
The whole point is to slow the wave that would hit all at once if we didn’t take action. Reality is either way lots will get it and 20% will need hospital care to survive it. If we didn’t do something to slow it’s spread a lot more would die because hospitals would be overwhelmed, at least if we slow it maybe we can save people. We don’t want to be in a position where hospitals are deciding who to treat and who to let pass. Unfortunately it might not matter
I have family in several other states and most have no limits on them (yet)
The only reason we are seeing or being told it’s slowed in China is because they are arresting people that ignore their lockdown orders. And is China even being honest with their reporting to begin with? If they aren’t we are all in trouble.
“The only reason we are seeing or being told it’s slowed in China is because they are arresting people that ignore their lockdown orders.”
Here they threaten you with jail but actually they are releasing people from jail because of virus fears. So do the Chinese not have a problem with those in prison … or do they just cease to be people?
BN,
You are equating two things that aren’t the same.
Stop pushing things that aren’t true. It’s time to be a responsible adult and realize that this is real. It has been here for weeks and our government locally and nationally have failed us.
Yogurt,
It is a serious question. If arresting people for violating curfew and locking them up is an effective strategy in China (is it?), then what are they doing that stops the spread amongst incarcerated persons?
ZZ Based on what information do you think I don’t know about American history? I know more than some Americans. I know about the civil war, Dec 7, 1941, the assassination’s of 4 President, I have read biography’s of both Roosevelts, Lincoln, Johnson and several on Kennedy. I was here in 1968 went MLK and RFK was shot (wish we had either of both around today) I was here when the Challenger blew up, I was here on 9/11. I’m quite steeped in the history of WWII, which includes a lot of history of the US. I have been fascinated by the US since I was in my teen’s I didn’t come here by accident, It was deliberate, after spending 2 years as an au pair in Ct, I went back to Denmark for 3 month and couldn’t wait to get back the East Coast, where I had a boy friend and friends.
I don’t see a conflict between feeling loyalty and love for both countries, I assume it is the same as having more than 1 child (I have one daughter) you love them all, but perhaps not in exactly the same way.
Silva and Atticus Traxx, Thanks for defending me and your kind words.
There are some really , really smart people here that know way more then the CDC and the expert doctors.
Diane Feinstein also sold 6Million in stock
Through a blind trust that all senators are supposed to do.
There are people saying her husband runs the trust but I don’t know for sure.
She has no control over what the trust does and she lost money doing that as well.
If you’re going post information, post it all.
So did a few Republicans, and from the number I heard 6 million is somewhat overblown, seems like it was more like $600.000. She has her money is in a blind trust and she does not control what happens.
In any case all those who, sold stock after a certain meeting should be investigating.
All four of them need to be investigated fully.
I think it doesn’t matter. There’s no right answer. And there’s no balance. Until there is balance. You can’t force someone to do something. Everyone has a choice. Until they are no longer breathing. Not everyone will get sick or die. Even if we did nothing. The projections are for a lot of people to get sick or to die. We have to be OK with that. We have to accept the worst case scenario based on the worst case variables. If we do that, and it’s not as bad, it’s a win, and we can recover and rebuild. If we have false hopes or fear, and we are not ready to accept the worst case of the worse, then we will Fail. We need to accept the Loss, bandage ourselves up, and get back out there. For the ones who survive. You can’t forget what happens and learn from every decision you make. Success relies on failures.
I don’t know about you but I have been social distancing for quite a while. I am not sick but I did have something that fit the description back in late January. Was that Covid-19? You wouldn’t think so based on the current reactions.
Please explain what could have been done to prevent the spread to the U.S. Even Greenland is reporting the virus. Did every single affected country “sit on their hands”? What were we supposed to do differently?
I have found in the situation one of two things.
This will either bring out kindness or cruelty in people
I plan to go to the kindness route.
The shelter in place is about protecting you but it is also about protecting others around you.
How much do you care about your community and the people that live in it?
Kindness – Good on you
I’m getting a little tired of the “You aren’t the boss of me “ folks.
We’re in the together and we will win.
Thank you Kindness, I couldn’t have said it better. It seems for some it is more important to prove a point, (hate Newsom, don’t trust government) than to protect themselves and others. By the way it is possible to dislike, hate whatever Newsom and not trust government and still do the right thing.
Amen to that! We are a civilization completely interdependent on each individual to do their part. Rules and laws are made for the good of societies as a whole, and at times they must be reevaluated and even be rapidly changed. If enough individuals just do whatever they feel like because nobody’s going to dictate to them what they should or shouldn’t do, our societies run the very serious risk of collapsing. It’s all happened many times before throughout our history. Bees and ants really have this stuff down.
The goverment is doing the best they can. If they ask for us to self isolate for the good of everyone then isolate.
Before a “Shelter in Place” order is implemented, I think the government needs to come up with a plan for those who will be out of work, that won’t have income to support their living expenses, such as rent and food. Most people live paycheck to paycheck. Government should have it figured out what they are gonna do about this then implement a shelter in place. It doesn’t help all the toilet paper is gone, people living paycheck to paycheck, people are out of work and what’s saddening is what are those doing who were living paycheck to paycheck and have a family to support.
Some companies are still paying their employees, I work for Macy’s and they will pay full timers for 28 hours a week. I understand about the people living paycheck to paycheck, but many that do could actually save for a rainy day. There are many things that can be eliminated, that people refuse to do. Just spending $3 to 5 dollars a day, would add up over time. I work at Macy’s and we have great deals when we have sales, and often if you have a Macy’s card or come in on a week end you can get an extra 20-25% off many items even if they are already on sale. However, many customer buy Nike and other name brands that are over priced and don’t take extra coupons.
I think this virus is an unusual situation and I have no problem with government helping out, but I hope people will learn from it and try to save some for a rainy day.
I use to have problems saving, and I listened to the wrong friends, who would say things like “Don’t deny yourself you deserve it”. No I deserve to have some savings so when I have an emergency with my car or similar I don’t freak out, but have the money to take care of it, without putting anything on my credit cards. I learned the hard way, and late in life, but better late than never. There is a certain peace of mind knowing you can handle emergencies without getting stressed out. Dave Ramsey and his radio program helped me a lot, wish I had know about him 20 years ago, I would have even more security.
This thread proves how entitled many of us feel. I don’t like being cooped up but I have no problem with the idea of saving lives. We have a lot of older people in our communities. They have always been there for me so I will do my best to keep them safe.
I totally agree.
Entitled to my liberty? Yes, thank you very much.
Liberties? You mean you’re ok with spreading the virus instead?
You’re focusing on the wrong things
“You’re focusing on the wrong things”
Spoken like a true leftist who believes the Constitution is just a piece of paper. I don’t need authoritarian government to order me to do the right thing under penalty of arrest. Apparently you do.
I’m with you MadMom! Great post!
Have you heard of anyone being laid off? I have 🙁
This is all bad.
While I love hawaii, please remember that covid19 is there already and spreading fast.
Stay safe please
No. The heartland does not have the metropolis personality or needs. Let the governor and mayors decide what to suggest and enforce. I expect them to come up with some spectacular innovation that could never Work in the over crowded cities.
No. Measures deemed necessary in densely populated areas like ours are not the right answer for areas with different population characteristics.
Wow this Rollo guy obviously is an expert not only in Constitutional Law and Economics but also in Public Health and Epidemiology, Boy what would we be doing without him? We would have to depend on people who have no clue such as Anthony Fauci who says:
“Some will look and say, well, maybe we’ve gone a little bit too far. The thing that I want to reemphasize, and I’ll say it over and over again, when you’re dealing with an emerging infectious diseases outbreak, you are always behind where you think you are if you think that today reflects where you really are.”
Because this fool believes that if for example found today 1,000 new Covid-19 cases, each of those positive tests reflects an infection up to two weeks ago. The situation has already worsened for the two weeks or so since those new cases were infected.
Absolutely not! Rural areas are different than urban areas. Do you expect farmers in the middle of Iowa that may have miles between homes to stay indoors?? Ridiculous! Very few things in life are “one size fits all”.
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Not sure what to believe because the tin man hasn’t packed his oil can again.
Just practice common sense, I just want to make a joke here so maybe I could put a smile on those of you who are panicking or worried because in times like this you need to have a sense of humor that’s how the best of us get around these interesting times in our lives so having said that work if the beer you’re drinking is making you puke or vomit or god for bed diarrhea then just switch to a different beer I mean it’s not that hard I mean South Park did some thing on the chipotle thing Where there’sblood in your underpants It was called chipotleaway or something, anyways I hope you understood my beer joke. And for those of you who didn’t there is a delightful Mexican beer called carona , anyway ✌️ Stay frosty America, no pun intended