Claycord – Talk About Politics

September 13, 2019 19:02 pm · 116 comments


This post is “Talk About Politics”.

Please use this post to talk about politics, and keep politics out of the “whatever” thread.

Thank you, and be kind to each other.

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Dr. Jellyfinger September 13, 2019 at 7:06 PM

Were Joe Biden’s teeth falling out last night or was it my imagination?

SF oh September 13, 2019 at 7:39 PM

… Don’t know about Biden’s teeth – I wasn’t watching. Too busy getting the record player ready for the kids.

Ricardoh September 13, 2019 at 8:02 PM

Not your imagination it was all part of the three hour clown act. How embarrassing these jokers are actually running for president.

The Wizard September 13, 2019 at 8:28 PM

After watching that, Trump’s got it in the bag. Turn out the lights the party over.

Bob Foo September 13, 2019 at 8:43 PM

Just to add, vinyl albums are outselling CDs for the first time in a long time.

Not supporting Biden. I hate the guy. But maybe he’s onto something here.

The Wizard September 13, 2019 at 8:28 PM

After watching that, Trump’s got it in the bag. Turn out the lights the party over.

The Wizard September 13, 2019 at 8:30 PM

I think Biden needs to go to Clear Choice. Looks like he got the deluxe grill that Mister Ed would be proud of.

Atticus Thraxx September 13, 2019 at 9:15 PM

What’s orange on the outside,
Hollow in the Middle
And should be tossed out in early November?

…..a pumpkin!

Have a nice weekend and for your own good, go outside, it’s going to be beautiful out!

Antler September 14, 2019 at 6:45 AM

You’ve gotten hold of the alternative truth answer books again!

Gittyup September 15, 2019 at 7:03 AM

Ghost of Marilyn Monroe haunting your dreams?

The Fearless Spectator September 13, 2019 at 9:40 PM

Rumor has it that devout liberal Yoko Ono is putting her hat in the ring….

Gittyup September 14, 2019 at 9:45 AM

If elected, will she be singing her acceptance speech?

Rollo Tomasi September 14, 2019 at 6:37 PM

She broke up the Beatles – no way the DNC survives.

Bob Foo September 13, 2019 at 10:26 PM

I am a tentative Trump supporter. I definitely am not an admirer of everything he does or stands for, but let’s face it. I wouldn’t trust any other candidate to have the experience in business and economics that he has. The media keeps complaining about a trade war, yet time after time, China has bent the knee because ultimately they NEED us to accomplish their goals. They recently decided NOT to put their own tariffs on pork and soy products from the U.S., mainly because they simply couldn’t find another country that could meet their demands. In addition, the statistics speak for themselves. Minority employment and wages are at a high, and consumer confidence is solid as well.

What bothers me is that we are so engrained in a very polar two-party system. I personally don’t align with Republicans or Democrats. They are both taking things too far. Taking that into consideration, I think the Democratic party is more divided, and to compensate for that, the presidential candidates are literally resorting to extremes to get support and donations. However, ultimately most Americans are fairly moderate and so if the Democrats don’t tone it down a bit, they won’t get the votes they need to take the White House. While there is a very outspoken progressive minority, that is not enough to seal the deal.

weppin September 14, 2019 at 6:34 AM

I agree with you. Probably 25% are far left, 25% are far right, and 25% don’t give a damn. That means the 25% in the middle will decide the election.

Captain Bebops September 14, 2019 at 9:17 AM

There are quite a number of people who “fancy” themselves “libruls” who would have been classified Middle-of-the-Road votes 20 years ago. They are not really liberal and don’t often know what they are talking about. And then we have those who “fancy” themselves “conservatives” who don’t know what they are talking about either. Quite a clown show.

Anonymous September 14, 2019 at 12:21 PM

Old Bob Foo just about speaks for me. It’s really a question of who is the least reprehensible . Warren and Sanders want to take over the economy . Kamala is a serial liar, and Biden’s a nice person who is a little confused at times. Trump can’t be trusted but he has gotten some results.

Kentucky Derby September 14, 2019 at 8:02 AM

41% of Americans are moderates, 40% are conservative, and 19% are liberal. Which means most Americans are moderates or conservatives, except in this state, where liberals outnumbers us.

Caskydiver September 14, 2019 at 9:12 AM

TRUMP 2020

Gittyup September 14, 2019 at 9:48 AM

International money transfers are draining the U.S. economy of nearly $150 billion each year! Congress can stop this ridiculous trend.

Bob Foo September 14, 2019 at 10:13 AM

I agree overall.

I don’t necessarily think it’s a bad thing to send money to your poor family elsewhere. I had a coworker from El Salvador who had very impoverished parents back home, and she literally had to send them money so they could survive. Apparently, groceries and medical costs down there are basically the same as here, only most workers make just a few bucks a day. So a days wages were basically just enough to buy food to make dinner for that night.

This coworker is truly one of the nicest, most hardworking people I have ever met. She moved to the U.S. when she was 19, after waiting a long time for a visa. She got a job at a fast food restaurant in the ghetto, and took English classes after work. She eventually worked her way up to a good technical career, from nothing but the clothes on her back and an optimistic spirit. She was not an illegal immigrant, and she had a lot of distain for them. When I worked with her, she finally got her U.S. citizenship after working hard for nearly 20 years. It was a beautiful thing.

Back to remittance though, my point is that there are a lot of legitimate reasons for it. Still, it’s part of the complicated situation that leads to illegal immigration. A simple solution would be a remittance tax, which would have little impact on most but would make illegal immigration less lucrative.

Jojo Potato September 14, 2019 at 2:25 PM

@Happy – you are right, the data I got was just for Latin America. So let’s look at the 2018 data. The national GDP was $20,500 billion. Taking Giityup’s data of $150 billion sent overseas. That’s less than 1%. Is this a problem? The US military budget for 2018 was $700b. I’d rather have that $150b sent overseas to at least help some people than on the military to kill people.

Rollo Tomasi September 14, 2019 at 6:43 PM

“how would you deal with foreign threats?”

How about shipping over pallets stacked with $1B cash in the dead of night?

Dr. Jellyfinger September 14, 2019 at 9:31 PM

That money could buy drones for Iran’s friends in Yemen to use on the Saudis…. thanks Obama!

Gittyup September 15, 2019 at 12:28 PM

I had several immigrant co-workers. One from Ecuador was keeping her household supplied with toilet paper from the restrooms on the third floor of Evans Hall at UC Berkeley. And, one from Iraq who told me they weren’t being persecuted and seeking asylum, they just all knew they had to say that to get in.

Dr. Jellyfinger September 15, 2019 at 6:04 PM

Ok… I gotta share this one…. I know we are not getting the best & brightest immigrants, legal or otherwise… here’s an example.

Years ago when I was in the restaurant biz there was a guy from Nicaragua working as a dishwasher and we had a mesquite grill there.

Every morning they’d dump the ashes from the night before into a metal garbage can and throw it in the dumpster a full day later to be sure it was all cooled & no embers.

Well…. this guy forgot what day it was a threw all the all the ashes in the dumpster which caught fire a few minutes later …. as we went running out to extinguish the flames the guy from Nicaragua was shouting “No, No” as we turned on the utility hose which was hooked up to hot water only…. “No, No” he cried…

He thought we couldn’t put out a fire with “HOT” water!

We were laughing so hard we couldn’t even be angry about it.

Dr. Jellyfinger September 14, 2019 at 11:09 AM

Confirmed today – Hamza Bin Laden (Osama Bin Laden’s son) was killed by US forces in Afghanistan/Pakistan region in July.


Rollo Tomasi September 14, 2019 at 6:45 PM

Obama will take credit any minute now…

1791 September 16, 2019 at 9:50 AM

Just curious, does the US have actual DNA proof (a body) of his demise? We have a history of disposing of Bin Laden garbage in the ocean…

Kirkwood September 14, 2019 at 12:16 PM

CNN has reported that drone strikes have disrupted 5% of Saudi Arabian oil production.

Bad Nombre September 14, 2019 at 3:09 PM

I’m hearing that the Saudis cut HALF of their production. I don’t believe that the attacks knocked out that amount of production.

Randy September 14, 2019 at 6:47 PM

What do you expect when you have president that thinks he’s buddies with dictators and wants to negotiate with terrorists. The US is perceived weak with a nut for a president who will do nothing but tweet “these are bad people”.

Rollo Tomasi September 14, 2019 at 7:41 PM

“The US is perceived weak with a nut for a president…”

Prove it.

Liar! Liar! September 14, 2019 at 8:01 PM

Randy is confused again. Obama was the bowing president who shipped pallets of cash to America’s enemies to build weapons of mass destruction to use against us.

Fred P. September 14, 2019 at 8:15 PM

And randy forgot obozo’s bowing scraping.


Fred P. September 14, 2019 at 8:24 PM

Randy – YOU have a president….

Don’t forget, Trump IS YOUR president…. and will likely be for another 4 years…..

Bonus – you also get a conservative SCOTUS for another generation.

Cry, snowflake, cry….

Original G September 14, 2019 at 8:37 PM

“The US is perceived weak with a nut for a president who will do nothing…”

The bowing apologizing invertebrate, is no longer president.

TT September 14, 2019 at 12:20 PM

Wow, so happy Gov. Gavin Newsom helped decrease murderers sentences so they are free to do whatever to the community.

Ricardoh September 14, 2019 at 1:34 PM

Newsom should serve every sentence these guys and girls are convicted of after they are released early. Plus pay for any loses. They are a motley looking crew. Good luck Newsom.

HappyPappy September 14, 2019 at 3:37 PM

Gov Nuisance has demonstrated his deep racism by releasing only one white criminal.

Dewey'sMom September 14, 2019 at 5:25 PM

A short surged:
When recall petitions for Gavin Newsom are available, will anyone here sign one?

Gittyup September 14, 2019 at 7:35 PM

Where is it, I’ll sign it? His arrogance in turning over the will of the voters on the death penalty is reason enough, but his “Welcome to California Abortion” and “No Tax On Tampax” didn’t help, either.

Dewey'sMom September 14, 2019 at 5:27 PM

A short survey:
When recall petitions for Gavin Newsom are available, will anyone here sign one?

Rollo Tomasi September 14, 2019 at 6:49 PM

I’ll sign it, and I’ll make damned sure all my dead relatives sign it too.

Bob Foo September 15, 2019 at 11:17 AM

Yes. He’s a slimeball. A key figure in the modern era of San Francisco’s downfall.

Sure, SF was a left-wing hellhole for a while before that, but in my “millennial” lifetime I have seen it get worse and worse.

Dewey's Mom September 14, 2019 at 5:46 PM

To the fearless spectator,
Unless the Constitution is amended, Yoko Ono was born in Tokyo, thanks heavens!
If she did run for president and won, she would probably perform her “Cut Piece” performance, you know, the one where she allowed the audience to snip a piece of her clothing as as souvenir, until she was left naked? This time, it would be the Democrat loser “hopefuls”, that would return home with a scrap of clothing from their idol!
No surprise to the rest of us moderates or conservative or even slightly “liberal”, we are so used to “whacked” behavior!

The Fearless Spectator September 14, 2019 at 6:42 PM

The real Yoko Ono wasn’t born until the day she bagged a Beatle!

It’s fun to IMAGINE her sitting down for a chat with Mr. Newsom. Two unbelievably arrogant yet delusional people surrounded by their hired psychophants. People of this nature should be in charge of nothing. To put it bluntly, they believe their own B.S., and there is a real danger in that for the rest of us. However the guys on former death row think Gavin is the greatest.

Original G September 14, 2019 at 7:00 PM

There are some speculating oil prices could spike due to attacks on
oil facilities at Abqaiq and Khurais.

‘ Attacks on oil facilities in Kingdom threaten world economy: Saudi energy minister ‘

‘ Kingdom ‘willing and able’ to respond to attacks, MBS tells Trump ‘

slagheap September 14, 2019 at 10:01 PM

That’s all you have to say, OG? Just what do you figure Trump is thinking right about now? This could lead to war. Reckon he has a plan to save your bacon, old man?

Original G September 15, 2019 at 3:22 PM

Merely furnishing URLs that might have information liberal media would not present because it doesn’t fit their narrative.

Doubt if they’d mention,
‘ Saudi Arabia admits to purchase of Chinese DF-21 missile ‘

‘ Satellite imagery raises suspicion of Saudi Arabia’s ability to produce missiles ‘

‘ Saudi Arabia and Pakistan may have just renewed a secret nuclear weapons pact ‘

Question, what would happen if Ghawar Field were put out of production for an extended period of time.

Ah don’t worry about it you guys have AOC, she’ll figure it all out.

“‘We need to be realistic’: AOC predicts Miami won’t exist ‘in a few years’ without Green New Deal”

June 29, 1989
‘ U.N. Predicts Disaster if Global Warming Not Checked ‘
“A senior U.N. environmental official says entire nations could be wiped off the face of the Earth by rising sea levels if the global warming trend is not reversed by the year 2000.”

Original G September 15, 2019 at 4:32 PM

Perusing the usual before market open on Monday, Oh Look ! ! !
WTI (west Texas intermediate) is up over $6 that’s 11 plus percent up.

Iran policy under obama,
‘ Iran harassed and humiliated the US Navy under Obama —
here’s why it stopped under Trump ‘

How fortunate the invertebrate is no longer president.

Original G September 15, 2019 at 7:25 PM

“U.S. naval forces destroyed two oil platforms in the Persian Gulf, sank a missile boat and severely damaged two Iranian frigates in a series of engagements begun early Monday…”

“U.S. Sinks or Damages 6 Iran Ships in Persian Gulf Clashes : Tehran Strikes Back After Oil Rig Shellings ”

‘ Obama Apologized – But This Is What REAGAN Did When Iran Attacked Our Navy ‘

Dewey's Mom September 14, 2019 at 7:17 PM

@Bob Foo, I too have met some lovely immigrants that came to this country legally and did all that they could to support their families in other countries; I applaud them, embrace them and support them with every fiber Of my soul, that being said, we have the rule of law and we must demand that it be upheld and respected; has anyone here looked at the rules of law in Mexico? Why should our country have to ignore our laws to cater to a leftist mindset, rubbish?!
There is a distinct difference between a liberal and a leftist and we can’t afford to go down the slippery slope of leftism, it will destroy our way of life!
I appreciate my home, my garden, my animals and I intend to support my liberty and yours, we need to wake up to what is at stake!

For those young people that have not been around that long, it is wise
To study history so you do not have to repeat it!

@Atticus Thrax, I do love a lovely orange pumpkin!

mtzman September 18, 2019 at 8:43 AM

So, why not simply change the law? That way, the rule of law would be upheld and respected, and you could then embrace them, applaud them, and support them with every fiber of your soul. Problem solved.

Gittyup September 15, 2019 at 12:01 AM

The NRA has filed suit against the San Francisco Board of Supervisors for labeling them a “terrorist organization” saying it violates their First Amendment rights, among other things.

S September 15, 2019 at 2:59 AM

slander; at least.

Gittyup September 15, 2019 at 7:33 AM

The declaration was in keeping with San Francisco’s wild exaggeration and over dramatization of virtually every human activity known to mankind. Meanwhile, areas of the city are blighted with piles of trash and closed businesses which the Board of Supervisors appears not to know how to fix. In their effort to appear relevant, they have reordered their priorities in order to avoid dealing with some of the more difficult ones.

Original G September 15, 2019 at 3:51 PM

NOW, Now, now, let us all remember folks across the bridge are fragile and their feelings could be hurt by certain words, which are unacceptable to them.

But they do still have their famous attractions,

Gittyup September 16, 2019 at 9:10 AM

🎶 If you’re goin’ to San Francisco 🎵
🎵 Just forget the flowers in your hair. 🎶
🎶 Bring, instead, a roll of toilet paper🎵
🎶 For the homeless await you there. 🎶

Sung to the tune of Scott McKinzie’s, “San Francisco.”

Randy September 15, 2019 at 9:06 AM

Gather round the old tire fire, my grandchildren, and let me tell you how the apocalypse began, with a story about Mike Pounce, Tim Apple, and the hurricane that wasn’t going to hit Alabama.

slagheap September 15, 2019 at 8:07 PM

” A lot of people tell me it’s impossible to make Middle East peace. I have reason to believe I can do it.”
Donald J. Trump.

Original G September 16, 2019 at 7:32 AM

So this is what California has become, . . . .

“Shocking moment two masked burglars kicked in the front door of a California home while the owner was inside…”

Dr. Jellyfinger September 16, 2019 at 8:11 AM

Well…. if they don’t already own a firearm they will now.

Fred P. September 16, 2019 at 8:17 AM

Yup – two democrat voters attempting to collect what they think is theirs….

Or as the democrats call them – “A person who has come in contact with a returning resident who was involved with the justice system and who is currently under supervision with a history of substance use.”

The world’s “5th largest economy” can’t even keep $hit off the streets. Instead, they vote them into office.

Fred P. September 16, 2019 at 11:19 AM

Democrats – They are the party of the KKK, the party that seceded from the Union which precipitated the Civil War, the party that refused to emancipate the slaves, the party that refused to give blacks the right to vote, that party that refused to give blacks the right to bear arms, the party of Jim Crow laws, the list goes on. Given this “legacy”, why on earth would any of them be concerned about history.

Randy September 16, 2019 at 12:25 PM

Yes the Saudis are directing US foreign policy. He’s a stable nut case. Thank you

Trump tweet :

“There is reason to believe that we know the culprit, are locked and loaded depending on verification, but are waiting to hear from the Kingdom as to who they believe was the cause of this attack, and under what terms we would proceed!”

Original G September 16, 2019 at 2:04 PM

There are consequences for continually electing progressive liberal politicians to CA state legislature in numbers which give them a super majority.

Recent bill passed gives landlords ability to raise rents at inflation rate plus 5%. Reflect on how much your take home pay has increased in past ten years. Then do some math starting with a rent of $2,000 a month, roughly what would it be in ten years ? ? Comes out to a little over $3,100 a month, not adding inflation rate in. Will you be able to handle those kind of rent increases ?

HAS your take home pay go up in excess of $100 per year ? ?

Another way to look at it, . . . democrats are responsible or your rent going up.

Atticus Thraxx September 16, 2019 at 3:42 PM

Go outside. Seriously.

Atticus Thraxx September 16, 2019 at 3:55 PM

I’d like to ask a serious question. Red Team only please…I have noticed in the gun debate that neither camp, the “more guns” folks or the “no guns folks” seem to have any interest at all in engaging run of the mill presumably rational gun owning Americans what they thought about solutions to gun violence. I am a lifelong shooter, arguably rational and I have my own thoughts. But I want to ask if in a paragraph or two, what solutions you’d bring to bear if it was up to you. No one else seems to be asking, I certainly haven’t been asked. To the extent you can keep ideology out of it, please do. I’m seriously curious.

Original G September 16, 2019 at 5:44 PM

Greatest problem, existing laws and reporting procedures are not followed and there are no consequences to those who fail to follow what’s already on the books.

Two examples,

Additionally media giving recognition and fame to mass shooters entourages copycats, who strive for fame of a higher body count.

Atticus Thraxx September 16, 2019 at 6:48 PM

OG, As usual you did not disappoint link-wise. That is a thoughtful argument and I sure can’t budge it on logic. In both cases the military knew it had powder kegs on their hands and instead of taking care of their own as is the oft repeated lie, they chose to just release them on an unsuspecting public. And people died. I’d go as far as to say this is criminal. It happens with service members and cops by the way.
So say if we’re looking at a pie chart, you just bit off 1/3 of it. That still leaves 2/3.

Dr. Jellyfinger September 16, 2019 at 7:03 PM

First off we need some honesty.
At least 60% of deaths by firearm are suicides and that is not part of the “gun violence” problem…. it should be addressed separately.

Suicidal people will jump off a building or a bridge, take a full bottle of pills & and a bottle of booze, hanging or whatever…. gun is just another option… not having one won’t stop suicide.

Accidents account for about 3%. NRA training would cut that number significantly if people would bother to get safety training.

80% of the deliberate violent shootings & homicides are committed by gang members and there lies the biggest problem… eliminate gangs and 80% of the real problem goes away…. eliminate the influx of gangs coming here from south of the border… deport the illegal immigrant gangsters already here.

Crack down on all the gangs, Bloods, Crips, Nortenos, Surenos… and eliminate all the bullying in schools (which is why alot of the kids get into gangs in the first place… they are tired of getting beat up!).

That is the problem.

Nothing wrong with reasonable regulation either, background checks for all (sure, why not?).

Limit magazines to 10 rounds? OK, nothing wrong with a little fire discipline and actually aiming at a target. Who really needs more than 10 uninterrupted shots?

10 day waiting period? Well…. OK but only if it’s your first gun purchase, otherwise it’s just stupid…. and let regulation stop there!

No more whittling our rights down till they disappear!

Original G September 16, 2019 at 8:09 PM

What is alarming is frequency at which these failures occur.
Virginia Tech 2007, Aurora Theater 2012, Tucson shooting 2011 in all three mental health problems of shooters were KNOWN.
A web search will supply details and should make people angry at failure of “the system”.

Atticus Thraxx September 16, 2019 at 9:48 PM

OG, I apologize I missed your second point about publishing the names of these shriveled beings and I think the main pushback is the so-called people’s right to know. I think we could solve that and keep Mother Liberty happy by making the names hard to get and then illegal to publish. If you want to know, you could eventually find out with an application to the appropriate jurisdiction, but couldn’t share it publicly. Done.
Jelly, Let me play Devil’s advocate one your very first point. Despite whatever you and I may believe to be true, every single medical association except the NRA’s infirmary have called firearm suicide part of the gun violence problem. The argument that potential suicide practitioners can use a number of different methods when they chose firearms first would be a difficult thing to prove one way or the other. We don’t know if they would have killed themselves any other way unless we force them to. Again, just devil’s advocate. Another thing is people who don’t have guns in their lives draw little distinction between self harm and harm of others when the tool is common. Just some heavy lifting is all I’m saying Jelly. Better, and I’ve seen you advocate this here before, is a full court press on mental illness. Like we did smoking and DUIs’. Didn’t cure it entirely, but no one can argue it isn’t better than it used to be.
I agree on safety. Heck I’d bet the number is twice that if they were all reported. Maybe thrice. Or qwice! The NRA is it’s own worse enemy on this. Because when I or any other American hear from the NRA what do we hear? They want money(memberships) They have politics. Not safety. Not civilian marksmanship program. Not youth camps. They want. They demand.
Your next point. 80%? Really? Gonna make me look that up? Okay so let’s say for arguments sake that any number is unacceptable. Control of our borders is not where any sane person wants it and I don’t have numbers to say how much gang violence is from from immigrants, but it’s probably a fat number. yeah, can’t argue with that. But I’d add both borders. If security is really what’s the concern. And I have my doubt about that with some. But yeah that is a weak spot for Liberals and they ain’t filled it with nothing but tissues. So what about the rest of the gang violence. The gangs that stem from multi-generational poverty? Bet that number is fat too. I guess we should cure poverty. Except…we keep giving entitlements to the rich. Who were already few and very rich. Getting fewer and richer too. I have no answer for that.
I completely agree with your last few points about mag limits and wait periods. Except maybe I’d add serious serious attempt at competency testing. Competency with the weapon I mean. If you think people drive like sh*t you should watch on a public range.
Thanks Jelly and OG.

Gittyup September 17, 2019 at 7:35 AM

In one case, the mass shooting at a Veteran’s home in Yountville CA, the targets were the mental health providers. If they couldn’t see it coming, or predict the volatility of the situation, is it any wonder that any mental health encounters a mass shooters has had in the past is ineffective in deterring and determining such events at some point in the future? In the Yountville case, the individual was denied treatment by the facility because of his behavior which only aggravated the situation.

It appears to be proven that the wide coverage of these events in the media tends to inspire copycats. At the same time, not reporting them, or the names of those responsible, is what could only be described as another step in corrupting the media as an arm of government propaganda … the filtered news … all the news that’s “approved” to print. While a means to a social engineering end, it only further damages the media’s credibility which at this point is in serious jeopardy of becoming a comedy show.

Suppose the individual considering such an action were offered, instead, another more positive way to achieve the “fame” they desire … before they resort to violence. In fact, should not, in a free society, paths to fame and fortune be available to all? Or, is that really the crux of the problem? These individuals may feel they have been, perhaps systematically, denied that which others enjoy. They may feel marginalized or uniquely excluded from participation in some aspects of their group. They may have a history of such treatment beyond the immediate situation.

It might be helpful to appeal directly to those so angry they would consider such an action, offering them alternatives to what must appear to them as the only action to end their pain and misery. Such individuals have been backed into a corner and feel the only way to end their suffering is, sadly, a violent one. Other acceptable alternatives may not be in their view or they aren’t thinking in a way that generates choices. Why do they desire to retaliate? Do they have a legitimate grievance that has not been addressed?

One can conclude that while some people put a great deal of faith in mental health services, they appear to be inadequate in situations like these to prevent future events and, in some, actually exacerbate the individual’s torment. It appears mental health professional are uniquely unqualified to predict future events not only of this type, but of many others, as well. And, someone amassing guns it not the tipoff, either, since the event can be accomplished with one gun just as well as many. Since law enforcement has a profile of the typical mass shooter, the possibilities have been narrowed down to men in a particular age group. What is it about this group then, that they have in common, which might trigger such an event; a physical episode such as temporary hormonal imbalance; a convergence of exterior factors too difficult for the individual to process given their position in society, their upbringing, their acquired attitudes; the long held notion that mental illness results from a “chemical imbalance?” Or, perhaps in what no one wants to admit, in similar circumstances any one of us would be capable of doing the very same thing.

mtzman September 17, 2019 at 12:33 PM

I’m not on the red team, but pardon me for jumping in here with regard to one point, and that is, guns and suicides. Take this source for whatever value you like, but it concludes that the notion that the unavailability of firearms will cause a suicidal person to simply use another means is not true. According to the source, guns account for only about 6 percent of all suicide attempts, but, because they are so effective, guns account for 54 percent of all successful suicide attempts. Moreover, 90 percent of people who survive a suicide attempt do not go on to kill themselves. Moreover, suicide rates are higher in states with higher gun ownership rates and in households with gun ownership. All of this suggests that limiting access or proximity to guns would lower suicide rates.

Atticus Thraxx September 17, 2019 at 2:22 PM

Thoughtful post Gittyup. It is easy to forget that humans are complex and just because someone is “in treatment” doesn’t mean they’re not still an imminent danger. So the question becomes…how do they get armed? I’m not sure where you were going with treatment in general, seem to think it’s a waste. I disagree. Correct me if I read you wrong.
You have an ax to grind with the media, and that’s fine. But their dilemma is real in this regard. Honestly there’s not an answer to it that will please everyone. I still like my idea.
Demographic information seems to point to a particular gender, race and age group is your contention, so you leave open the question of what drives people over the edge. I don’t know. I fall into that “mass shooter demo” and this past year went through pretty severe tests of my emotional resiliency. Not once did hurting anyone or myself even creep up. But push a little further a little longer and who knows? We all have our limits. Add drugs and/or alcohol to mental illness and you have a recipe for harm.
mtzman I’ll read that stuff tonight. I gotta go see a guy about some custom scope rings, ironically enough.

Gittyup September 17, 2019 at 10:33 PM

@ Thraxx To a person, everyone I have known who has sought and received psychiatric or psychological help was seriously harmed by it. Whatever problems they had going in, they were magnified, converted to serious psychological issues, and untreatable coming out. Some minor, inconsequential anti-social tendency became anorexia. Some tendency to depression became massive over-eating. I mean the kind of over-eating where Jerry Springer sends a boat hoist or an industrial forklift to take the person to the hospital. Some shyness or social anxiety became delusional psychosis complete with repetitive movements and hearing voices, and so on. Some of this could have been a result of medication, but the individuals were, to a person, chemically and/or psychologically castrated in the process and remained joyless and unmotivated as long as they remained under treatment. None married or had children. Their confidence, their faith in themselves, their intuition were destroyed in the process. They were, in fact, rudderless as a result, stripped of their petsonality. I don’t believe what is being offered is worth the tradeoff or an effective way to deal with one’s problems from what I’ve seen. Mental health professionals don’t turn out successes, they turn out socially mitigated but acceptable failures.

Gittyup September 18, 2019 at 4:21 PM

So, Thraxx, you’re suggesting the media, when detailing a mass shooting, report the event in the manner, “Some guy did something?” Sounds vaguely familiar.

Atticus Thraxx September 18, 2019 at 4:52 PM

Gittyup if that is in fact the case, I would offer that your small sample size and clear distrust of the profession I’m picking up reading your posts might be affecting your objectivity. I have known people who have and continue to get great help in the struggle with whatever demons have taken roost in their minds. I’ve been to exactly one session and again small sample size, but I left thinking it’s a good thing I’m not in serious crisis too. So it’s not that I’m saying your wrong. But people can and do benefit from competent mental health care overall. Besides, we don’t have anything else. If a leaky rowboat is all that is between you and drowning, grab the ‘effing rowboat.
mtzman I went to that site and it is kinda jaw dropping and from the 15 minutes I spent there seemed well sourced(?). If you find the suicide statistics by state graphic I found another thing odd. With exceptions for the Pacific Northwest states, the blue states all had lower suicide rates than red states. Significantly lower. Which I guess follows your broader point. I guess church and family values only go so far.
And here’s a dirty little secret, I take some solace in the fact that if things really did get that bad and there was no hope, I could if I chose to, end it with about 2 1/2 lbs of finger strength. I reserve that right, most of all. Mostly because my doctor will not write me an Rx for a lethal dose of morphine to take home and put in the gun safes for a rainy rain. Bastids!. 😉

Gittyup September 16, 2019 at 5:25 PM

You almost have to ask yourself, “Who is the more childish? A man who was elected President of the United States, or those who attempt to harass, mock and bully him with a childish balloon?”

Atticus Thraxx September 16, 2019 at 6:40 PM

I’m assuming that’s not a rhetorical question, so my answer is it’s a tie.

Gittyup September 17, 2019 at 8:23 AM

Donald Trump has survived what those who mock him cannot even imagine.

JWB September 17, 2019 at 10:21 AM

Now that’s pretty sad, that you have to ask that question…..

I would have hoped we would have a little higher bar for the President.

Silva September 17, 2019 at 2:42 PM

All the mean words certainly have got under his skin.

Atticus Thraxx September 18, 2019 at 4:10 PM

“Donald Trump has survived what those who mock him cannot even imagine.”
How did I miss that post? Pray tell sir, enlighten me on the suffering Clown Baby has endured. But first, subtract both the wounds he inflicts on himself and the wounds he inflicts on others. You’ll come up with a negative number. It is we who endure.

Gittyup September 18, 2019 at 10:38 PM

@Thraxx You’ll have to wait for the book he writes when he leaves office. Another best seller, I’m sure.

Atticus Thraxx September 19, 2019 at 6:21 AM

No matter how many copies sell he’ll claim it’s a best seller. That’s who he is.

Gittyup September 19, 2019 at 10:55 AM

Oooo, Freudian slip … but a nice one. That was supposed to say, “Good for him.” But, God for him, too.

slagheap September 16, 2019 at 6:30 PM

Trump is still waiting for the Saudis to tell him what to do next. He also just said he might take some unspecified action, but only if they pay us!

Dr. Jellyfinger September 16, 2019 at 7:56 PM

OK…. I wouldn’t mind US Troops doing a mercenary task as long as it serves the interests of the USA too… and if it can be done with missiles & air power …. on the Saudi’s dime.

Original G September 17, 2019 at 11:21 AM

When the pain of Today is greater than the pain of tomorrow, negative actions can result.

My opinion . . . .
An inability to objectively problem solve can lead to self medication, with drugs and/or alcohol, which is a short lived band aid that can lead to further problems.

Self medication is used as the answer to upset they feel. Sometimes word disease is used to describe the process. If you break the word up you get Dis Ease, . . . they medicate to feel better.

Taking time from your day to perform the simple act of listening while another relates their ruminations is an act of kindness that could well deescalate what might become rage. Keep in mind professional help can also be needed.

There have been recently stories of people being observant and responsible, who contacted Police and prevented mass shootings.

HappyPappy September 18, 2019 at 10:48 AM

Enjoy a slice of beto-toast….

HappyPappy September 19, 2019 at 10:25 AM

The cartoon changes daily, check out September 28 for beto-toast.

HappyPappy September 18, 2019 at 11:05 AM

Yet Another Excuse!

Hillary’s back squawking and she still can’t get over her loss to Big Don. Yesterday, grim, dressed in black, and startlingly more rotund than in 2016, the Beast raved about “voter suppression” as the “number one” reason for her loss. She spoke of the advice she gave to 2020 democrat losers about the lessons she learned from her campaign. Just follow her instructions for a sure win, guys.
Nearly dislocating her shoulder, she also patted herself on the back for running “the best campaign.” Ms. Warren paid the utmost attention and agreed with every word.
The doctors say her meds failed because she refuses to take them claiming they block the guiding voices.
Secretly, Warren agreed to stop her meds too.

slagheap September 18, 2019 at 6:56 PM

LOL, going on four years and you nitwits are still all about Hilary. I guess she was a pretty damned good candidate after all!

Dr. Jellyfinger September 18, 2019 at 9:02 PM

It would be easier to forget her if she would JUST GO AWAY!

Plus she should be in prison and some of us really get pizzed when corrupt officials let connected criminals go free after committing crimes we commoners would be jailed for….. for years!

HappyPappy September 18, 2019 at 10:11 PM

Okay….that’s it then, no more comments about The Beast cuz slagheap gets too upset.

HappyPappy September 18, 2019 at 11:32 AM

Isn’t it sad, these democrat “debates” offer so little opportunity for detailed, accurate policy discussions and always end up being a battle of appearances, verbal style, clever quips, and mind-games.
The unsophisticated & uninformed nominate and elect the leader of the most powerful, important country on earth mostly on the basis of who can impress the unsophisticated, uninformed, barely-attentive swing voter with the snappiest one-liner.
And no, I ain’t claiming the repubs ain’t guilty too. It’s just that the current circus of fools representing the dems are so profoundly inept. Just look at who is leading in the polls!

Original G September 18, 2019 at 2:55 PM

‘ ‘Your friends are dying while you stand there and video it’: Teen, 16, is stabbed to death in violent after school brawl over a girl while 80 other kids FILM it – and do nothing to help ‘

Tragic commentary on callous indifference of youth. Between video game violence, movies and TV productions with almost nonstop violence and on screen killing, is no wonder youth are desensitized.

Have to wonder about family values and church attendance of the 80 or so who watched the killing, an can watch it over and over because they recorded it on their phones.

Original G September 18, 2019 at 3:16 PM

Hmm, some have theorized if crime got really bad ordinary citizens would surrender Constitutional Rights in exchange for a governmental “promise” of crime reduction and safety.

Then there’s this,
“One year after the mass shooting in Florida, Gavin Newsom institutes the policies that made it inevitable.”

From obama administration,

‘ Did an Obama-Era School Discipline Policy Contribute to the Parkland Shooting? ‘

Does repeatedly demonstrating to youth, who act out, there will be no discipline or criminal charges only serve to encourage and embolden anti social behavior? Do such coddling policies lead to a cycle of increasing violence possibly resulting in loss off life ?

Comments ? ?
Alternatives ? ?

Justifiable anger September 19, 2019 at 7:17 AM

Common knowledge: Stand up to the bully.

Common sense:

slagheap September 19, 2019 at 9:55 PM

Two Obama administrations. Eight years. No indictments.

Gittyup September 20, 2019 at 12:59 AM

… yet.

Dr. Jellyfinger September 20, 2019 at 8:52 AM

Did anybody expect Obama’s corrupt, scandal ridden administration to do anything to punish people who should have gone to prison?

Eric Holder, Lois Lerner,Loretta Lynch,Hillary Clinton…. just to name a few?

Atticus Thraxx September 20, 2019 at 6:29 AM

Clown Baby has to go. He’s as dirty as a diaper and his utter lack credibility and integrity leaves him unfit for office.

Dr. Jellyfinger September 20, 2019 at 9:15 AM

Right on Atticus!

Over two years of FBI investigations we gotta be ready by now…

But please remind us…. what are the actual charges on that list of high crimes & misdemeanors?

Or do you mean we should just vote him out of office?…..
in favor of who?…
Joe (where am I?) Biden…#1 Socialist Bernie Sanders.. #2 Socialist Elizabeth Woo Woo Warren (and her $640 billion plan to eliminate tuition for public colleges and cancel student loan debt for millions Americans)….. or any of the other dozen or so Left Wing Fanatics (and their Green Economy Killer plans) out there in the Peanut Gallery?

Jojo Potato September 20, 2019 at 9:06 AM

From Trump on twitter: “is anybody dumb enough to believe that I would say something inappropriate with a foreign leader”? Yes, Donald, I believe you are stupid enough to do practically anything. ROTFL.

HappyPappy September 20, 2019 at 11:14 AM

“The Radical Left Democrats and their Fake News Media partners, headed up again by Little Adam Schiff, and batting Zero for 21 against me, are at it again! They think I may have had a “dicey” conversation with a certain foreign leader based on a “highly partisan” whistleblowers”

Donald Trump

Jojo Potato September 20, 2019 at 11:35 AM

Do you really think Mr. Trump should use insulting nicknames for all the people he disagrees with? I think it’s childish and stupid. If he has an argument then make it, no need to resort to middle school name calling.

Jojo Potato September 20, 2019 at 12:32 PM

Have no idea what you are talking about Pappy. But I hope you enjoyed it.

Dr. Jellyfinger September 20, 2019 at 2:05 PM

I believe the question was “Do you really think Mr. Trump should use insulting nicknames for all the people he disagrees with? ”

I understood HP’s response perfectly…. he should have put a ? after “So what” & “right potatohead” …. had a fat finger typo “you’d” (hit the s key instead of the d)…. but other than that, very easy to comprehend.

Liberals sometimes pretend to not understand a question when they don’t want to answer… I think that might be the case here.

Jojo Potato September 20, 2019 at 3:30 PM

I guess you are trying to pretend Pappy’s “answser” makes some sense based on typo problems. You are not convincing. It is easy to understand that middle schoolers use insulting names instead of rational arguments. Just like Mr. Trump!

Dr. Jellyfinger September 20, 2019 at 4:47 PM

I’ve seen worms that wiggle less than you Jojo!

Dr. Jellyfinger September 20, 2019 at 5:13 PM

I’m confused Jojo…

Posting that Trump is “stupid” and acting like a “middle schooler” you are not actually calling him names …. you are just identifying his behavior?

Is that how it works?
(because it sure looks like you’re calling him names).

Randy September 20, 2019 at 5:41 PM

The whistleblower needs to speak out. Put an end to trump snd his games.

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