BART Invites Riders to Test “Fleet of the Future” Seats Again this Week

October 29, 2013 19:00 pm · 31 comments

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BART’s Fleet of the Future project to replace its aging train cars is moving to a new phase this week as the public gets another chance to try out realistic prototypes of seats provided by the train car manufacturer.

BART has begun hosting and will be hosting nine events total at stations throughout the Bay Area where participants will get to try three different train car seats and then fill out a survey to record their assessment of seat comfort.  The seats will have three different cushion densities- soft, medium, and firm- but all will have easy to clean surfaces, silicone cushions that have a long life and retain shape over time, will be made with 74% recyclable materials and will be lightweight to reduce energy needed to move the train.

Three events will be held at the following stations this week:

  • October 30th  at Pleasant Hill Contra Costa Centre Station 1 pm – 7 pm
  • October 29th at West Dublin/Pleasanton Station 3 pm – 7 pm
  • November 1st at Lake Merritt Station Plaza 3 pm – 7 pm
Concord Mike October 29, 2013 at 7:18 PM

Looks like about 50% fewer seats to me. Are these cattle cars or are we getting seating design ideas from Ryanair?

Anon October 29, 2013 at 7:50 PM

Fewer seats, higher fairs (thanks unions) and no doubt another strike in 4 years!

BART, you just have to hate our workers!

Anon October 29, 2013 at 7:54 PM

Less seats and more bikes allowed on BART……

And I’ll bet the fare prices are gonna go up.

Neal October 29, 2013 at 8:01 PM

There are NO WHERE NEAR ENOUGH seats on this train!

Despite the new look, the old seats look more comfortable because they have more cushion.

There’s definitely room to stand on this train.

Seat should fit great! October 29, 2013 at 8:21 PM

I predict the seats will be the most comfortable ever! And they will continue to improve…WHY??

BECAUSE our wallet is much thinner now, duh!

SO ANNOYED October 29, 2013 at 8:43 PM

I’M WITH NEAL; I DON’T WANT TO PACKED LIKE CATTLE INTO A CAR; I WANT TO SIT DOWN. I HAVE AN HOUR PLUS COMMUTE ON BART. THAT CAR SUCKS BUT IT IS A BIT OF AN IMPROVEMENT WHICH ISN’T SAYING; IT WON’T FIT GARCE’S FAT ARSE. MAYBE IF I TYPE IN ALL CAPS BART MORONS OOPS MANAGEMENT WILL GET IN THROUGH THEIR THICK SKULLS AS WELL AS THE FACT THAT FIVE-CAR TRAINS AT MIDNIGHT ABSOLUTELY SUCK.

Dorothy October 29, 2013 at 8:54 PM

Good grief! Haven’t they been tested enough? How about testing a layout that provides the maximum number of seats? Seems to me they had promised there would be seats for everyone. (Promises, promises.) Hope they are easy to replace.

Anon October 29, 2013 at 9:17 PM

Make the seats wide enough for your fas arsed employees to fit into.

Craig October 29, 2013 at 9:49 PM

I’m with Neal too. Not enough seats, and these seats don’t look very comfortable. More like something you would see on a bus.

For what people pay to ride BART, give people the comfortable seats they deserve.

Pat Burrell October 29, 2013 at 10:09 PM

Creepy bridge and tunnel

Teacher Wannabe October 29, 2013 at 10:58 PM

@Anon, Yes, more room for bikes! Its about time. The extra room can also be used for those selfish people who complain about being too close to bike riders.

Dr. Jellyfinger October 29, 2013 at 11:12 PM

Seats? Who gives a flying green weenie about the seats? It’s the tube that goes beneath the bay that needs updating. I’m talking about a clear ultra strong and layered polymer nanocomposite tube with floodlights focused on the bay outside so we could see sharks & crabs & sturgeon, etc. Now that’d be worth the cost of the ticket.

Nicholas Evans October 30, 2013 at 12:30 AM

So what I understand is how does a company get contracted out to make The seats in cars like when does the public ever have a say. This to me seems like the same thing with public schools and solar panels someone’s gonna profit off a public entity. It’s not right to waste our precious taxpaying money on someone’s false prophets for recycled BART cars. Just saying as a concerned citizen.

anon October 30, 2013 at 1:21 AM

“MAYBE IF I TYPE IN ALL CAPS BART MORONS OOPS MANAGEMENT WILL GET IN THROUGH THEIR THICK SKULLS AS WELL AS THE FACT THAT FIVE-CAR TRAINS AT MIDNIGHT ABSOLUTELY SUCK.”

Nothing will matter– they do not care about you one bit & neither does the unions–they are laughing at us all the way to the bank……

BagsFlyFree October 30, 2013 at 6:50 AM

@ Mr Evans. I’d pause on your comparisons to the solar panels Mdusd installed. If anything, Bart should follow suit and they would have an expanded budget (non inflationary power bill) to pay their cattle “unions” while bart riders aren’t packed into trains like muni riders.

Much of this design is capacity and cleanliness focused. While these seats look uncomfortable they prevent laying across.

BFF Out!

WhereDidAllTheSeatsGo October 30, 2013 at 8:31 AM

Where did all the seats go? Hopefully, this is just to test the seats and won’t be the look of the new cars. If this is how the new cars are going to be laid out, there aren’t enough seats! Ugh!

It’s not like a BART trip is like a quick Muni trip. If this is the new layout, people will have to stand for over 1 hours in some cases. Let’s hope that BART didn’t get stupid and isn’t planning on having the majority of people stand.

@Neal October 30, 2013 at 8:51 AM

The old seats look more comfortable??? The urine, blood and vomit stains on those things are enough to make anyone stand. But sadly, how many times have I sat my tired butt down on there anyway. If this guarantees that I can get home with the certainty that I sat on a clean dry seat, that is worth a lot.

Don P - N. Concord October 30, 2013 at 8:52 AM

The fleet of the future looks more like a kids idea of what the future would look like. Not surprised though because as we all know by now BART cannot do a single thing correctly, efficiently, cost effectively, or with the general public’s greater interest in mind. BOYCOTT BART

escapehatch, October 30, 2013 at 9:26 AM

Click on the link “BART’s Fleet of the Future” for more at,
http://www.bart.gov/about/projects/cars/customer-feedback.aspxhttp://www.bart.gov/about/projects/cars/table.png
3% fewer seats, also narrower and higher but “wipeable”,
armrests between seats,
50% more doors,
bicycle racks at center doors,
multi-branch poles.
Less comfort, but at least you can get on, even with your bike.

Sharla October 30, 2013 at 9:30 AM

first time for everything including an agreement, boycott bart. Why can’t they get it right the first time.

Average Claycordian October 30, 2013 at 10:45 AM

Greetings mentally challenged commenters. I have used Math to determine that there will actually be 45% more seats in the future fleet. Try Math, it’s helpful, don’t be afraid.

Anon October 30, 2013 at 11:20 AM

They need to have cars with no seats and just bike racks for bikes only. Then make other cars with more seating period. Easy. Solved. Everyone’s happy. Bikers get a dedicated car. Riders don’t have to be crowded by bike tires.

William October 30, 2013 at 12:13 PM

I rode BART every work day for the past five years from WC to SF and back. After the most recent strike I said “Never again” and looking at these stupid new seat (lack thereof) configurations looks like I made the right choice. Bye bye Bart…

anon October 30, 2013 at 12:36 PM

@Average #21…. uhhh….

Accordingt to BART’s web site – “The new configuration of seats will allow for roughly 10% more standing room in each train car compared with todays train cars, while reducing seats per car by less than 3%. Extra standing room will help alleviate crowded commutes and provide a comfortable trip for passengers who are only traveling a few stops. ”

Looking at the pictures, it still comes out with fewer seats. A typical car had 32 seats, which allowed for 64 seated passengers (16 seats between the doors and car ends at both ends and 16 seats between the two sets of doors in the center – facing back and front). The new cars, per BART’s web page, shows ~21 seats, allowing for 42 passengers. Those drawings also match BART’s photos on the same page.

Unless you’re privy to some information that nobody else has (including BART), we’re still left with fewer seats. In that sense, no math will help.

Remember, GIGO.

teri October 30, 2013 at 12:58 PM

I have asked two of my deaf friends what they think of BART’s idea of sending announcements directly to hearing aids and implants. Both people were against it. One said persons should get to opt-in or out. And the other said her device was deprogrammed and she was given an electrical shock by an over the air announcement once.

Average Claycordian October 30, 2013 at 3:05 PM

@anon #24
The Current Fleet has 39,220 seats, the future fleet will have 57,000 seats. There will be 2.8% less seats per car but many more cars on the tracks. That will be a major improvement.

anon October 30, 2013 at 3:21 PM

@Average…… that’s assuming that they can run the trains closer together to make the additional cars used/useful. It doesn’t do the public any good if they have thousands of seats sitting in idled cars in the yards.

So is the computer dispatching system capable of handling the reduced headway to support using more and/or longer trains? Or is this going to be the new roadblock that requires another infusion of $$$?

My gut feeling says no – based on what I’ve seen to date. However, if you have more info on that, I’m willing to look.

Average Claycordian October 30, 2013 at 4:13 PM

@anon
The system is expanding plus at peak times and there are many 8 and 9 car trains that will likely be 10 car trains in the future. Additionally the new trains will be lighter and require less energy and probably move faster. They will no doubt raise the rates annually and make you show proof that signed up for Obamacare to ride the train.

concord October 30, 2013 at 8:01 PM

I haven’t heard anything about additional service, i.e., trains, which they need NOW! If they have all these cars, why five-car trains all the time!

Anon October 30, 2013 at 10:20 PM

@average#28…

Ouch, ya got me……

Scott October 31, 2013 at 1:39 PM

BART is trying to be too much. In San Francisco, Oakland, and Berkeley it is a metro/subway low speed train with frequent stops. For the rest of us, including all of Contra Costa, it is a commuter train with about one stop per municipality. Putting these cars that will cause more passengers to stand will only tell Contra Costa residents that BART isn’t interesred in our needs. Most customers would not like to spend two to three hours standing on BART each day. The system should be divided in to two different overlapping systems to meet the appropriate high speed needs of longer distance travelers, and low speed needs of shorter distance metro/subway travelrs.

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