The Water Cooler – Campaign Hit Pieces & Your View on Voting

October 29, 2012 12:00 pm · 32 comments

The “Water Cooler” is a feature on Claycord.com where we ask you a question or provide a topic, and you talk about it!

The “Water Cooler” will be up Monday-Friday at noon!

When a person or group sends out a negative campaign mailer, does it help to sway your vote to the person the mailer was directed towards, or do you think negative ads assist the person they’re intended to help?

Talk about it….

Anon October 29, 2012 at 12:05 PM

No but to be honest, I don’t read them. They immediately go into the trash. I sort my mail over the garbage can. I pull out any bills and letter and the the advertisements go straight into the can.

Jojo Potato October 29, 2012 at 12:08 PM

Huh? Your question doesn’t make sense to me. But I agree with Anon, I don’t read them anyway.

Howard K Mullins III October 29, 2012 at 12:09 PM

I generally don’t bother to read the mailers, they go straight into the recycling bin. Most political verbiage is a lie anyhow, so why bother.

Negative political mailers only reinforce my disgust with and hatred of politicians in general. Right, left, up, down, black, white, green, blue, paisley, I don’t care. I can think of no one in government (any level, city to federal) today worth the respect of the decent people in America. There may be one or two, I just don’t know of them. The rest of them? Worth about as much as spit.

Run Away Pay October 29, 2012 at 12:10 PM

When a negative ad comes out, start looking at the money. Someone perceives a threat to their gravy train. Prop 32 is another example, negative ads started over a month ago and that’s a big tip off. Money against 32 comes from unions and money contributed against is twice amount contributed for, giant red flag. Same with Q, fire district has a gross control of overtime problem. When employees can rack up over $100,000 in overtime in addition to their regular salary, there’s no sympathy. Management is to BLAME.

Beacon October 29, 2012 at 12:11 PM

Hit pieces can be just as misleading as any other campaign communications. It is impossible to know if your intentions are being met by your vote. Even if your intentions are met, there might be other unrelated items added to the initiative.

Democracy isn’t easy and it only works when those in power put the interests of the many ahead of the interests of the few.

Anonymous October 29, 2012 at 12:15 PM

This surely doesnt make me want to vote republican! Obama is married with children, obviously whoever left this message isnt very intelligent and no one needs someone else to think for them. Think for yourselves people. Leave all the BS out of it and look at facts and decide what you believe is the correct choice. Quit being lazy and do your own research.
“I am at shaver. This election is the most important in our lifetime America will not survive another four years of Barack Obama. He will push America into bankruptcy. He is a socialist insanely committed to abortion in the destruction of marriage and there’s no friend of Israel. We need to do everything possible to vote him out of office. I urge you to pray and vote. Every vote will count. Your vote is essential to speak to your friends and neighbors and urge them to vote out Obama

Anon777 October 29, 2012 at 12:18 PM

NEVER read any mailers – they go straight to the recycle bin, along with the rest of the mail garbage. Please people SAVE SOME TREES!

NEGATIVE comments about candidates etc. never get my attention. I don’t give any credence to negative comments from an opposing candidate. I want to hear how good a candidate is and what they CAN do, rather than hearing their negative comments about others.

Killjoy October 29, 2012 at 12:20 PM

I don’t read any of them. There’s an old saying. “Consider the source.”

I read the voter info pamphlet that is sent out with all the candidates info and the pros and cons about each proposition and try to make an informed vote that way.

Charles-the-cat October 29, 2012 at 12:28 PM

I pay attention to what the mailers say about who supports and opposes the target prop or candidate. Anytime I see make-believe groups like “Taxpaying Consumer Citizens United for a Responsible California Future”, I definitely look more favorably to the opposing view.

Anonymous October 29, 2012 at 12:48 PM

Don’t vote for any attorneys and don’t vote for any public employees.

Connie Dobbs October 29, 2012 at 12:55 PM

It’s a negative ad for the candidate who endorsed it.
Kinda like that third debate.

Dutch October 29, 2012 at 12:55 PM

I’ve been following the elections and all of the propostions for a long time now so I don’t really read the flyers. If anything I’ll clance at them and in the case of the negative ones it just reinforces my decision for the choices I’ve made. I’d rather see campaign ads that tell me what they are going to do and not belittle the opposition or try to scare me into voting their way.

Antler October 29, 2012 at 12:55 PM

Run Away Pay at #4 ~ ~ ~ Please read Proposition 32 more carefully. On the surface it sounds beautiful…….a union cannot deduct contributions without asking the union members, right? But the END result is that unions’ lobbying impact would be curtailed BUT that of corporations, PACs, etc. would not have the same restrictions. Karl Rove created a PAC which has funneled over $70,000,000 into the campaign to PASS Proposition 32; the national Tea Party/Republican motive is to crush the unions in California.

Consider the ethical groups which oppose Proposition 32.

I check what is being said in the fliers and research as best I can until I get to the facts. Some literature, however, is so blatantly ludicrous and so tabloid in appearance and headlines that I toss it on principle. Always ask “Is this a statement of fact about the sender’s bio and her own point of view? ……or is this a character assassination meant to trick me?

Chuckie's Wife October 29, 2012 at 1:11 PM

Since I vote permanent absentee, I’m usually done voting before the political mailers hit. But if that were not the case, I’d probably do some background checking on the candidate being slammed, just to be sure if the allegations on the hit piece are valid. Depending on the outcome of my research I might change the vote, but it would NEVER be for the person/group that sent out the hit piece in the first place.

@Anonymous (#6) – who says the message you received was from the Republican party? AND your reasoning is flawed. Romney is also married with children, so if that’s your basis for voting for one candidate or the other…you should vote for Romney – he has more kids.

Tells more about the candidates than... October 29, 2012 at 1:13 PM

The worst things about these pieces is that the candidates that the issuing organization endorses can claim: “Hey, It wasn’t me who mailed it” while (1) not rebuffing the “hit” itself and (2) enjoying the benefits…

I’m still waiting for Tim and Dan to remove the POA-endorsement from their websites… but, sadly, I might be waiting until Nov 7th.

Cowellian October 29, 2012 at 1:19 PM

In a perfect world, I’d use the hit piece as evidence that I shouldn’t vote for the sender, but in actuality, I’m not willing to spend that much time evaluating them. They go into the trash, unread.

Anon October 29, 2012 at 1:36 PM

Supposedly it takes 1 negative comment to affect 4 positive comments, at least that’s the data from online comment sections.
I just paid “my” taxes and $275.00 went to the School District. You’ve got to be kidding me – I Don’t even Have kids. What Socialism we have here.
I’ll be voting NO, NO and NO for any thing that looks like a Tax hike.

Smokey October 29, 2012 at 1:39 PM

#6 needs to spend a little time away from Fox News.

Anonymous October 29, 2012 at 1:52 PM

#14 my reasoning makes perfect sense “He is a socialist insanely committed to abortion in the destruction of marriage…” Obama is married with children yet he is “insanely committed to abortion and the destruction of marriage” that doesnt make sense!
Never said this was my basis for voting for one or the other, that would be a pretty idiotic basis.

Palermo October 29, 2012 at 1:53 PM

Everything goes into the bin. I assume people will lie and say anything to get elected at all levels of govt sadly.

Money spent on prop 32 October 29, 2012 at 2:29 PM

@antler #13
The unions have spent more than 35,000,000.00 against prop 32.
The teachers union alone more than 16,000,000.00.
The difference between what you state and what I state is that the Supreme Court of the United States declared the PACs legal,(the same court that have you Obamacare).
That is why the presidential campaigns are spending 2,000,000,000.00 to elect the next President.
Seems kind of oxymoronic since Nobama chastised SCOTUS in his State of the Union address.

anonymous October 29, 2012 at 5:42 PM

This time I only read the hit piece on Birsan becuase the headlines and crazy photo caught my attention. The I decided I would not vote for whoever the POA endorsed. If they were dumb enough to send out that stupid hit piece, I question their judgement on their endorsed candidates.

All other mailers went in the recycle bin.

Mad Mom October 29, 2012 at 5:58 PM

Run Away Pay just did a hit piece on prop 32 so now I know for sure that I’m voting yes on 32!
Seriously, all the negative ads turn my stomach. I just want the facts! The records and yes, who is sponsoring it. But I need to do the research. I don’t rely on FOX to lead me to the ballot box

Antler October 29, 2012 at 6:40 PM

#21 ~ ~ ~ You’re deflecting and not addressing the bottom line of what Prop 32 means for the California union members.

Anon October 29, 2012 at 7:12 PM

When a candidate (Edi Birsan) repeatedly emails me spam and ignores requests to stop, it drops him off my candidate consideration list. Similarly, when a candidate (Kumar) posts a picture of President Obama on his newly uprighted posters downtown to even pretend like he has Obama’s support, it drops him off my candidate eligibility list. Both instances show a lack of class. As to hit pieces against candidates, that POA PAC-funded mailer was a shame. Were they a candidate and not an independent organization, they wouldn’t receive my vote at all.

Money spent on Prop 32 October 30, 2012 at 7:39 AM

@Antler #24
I am not deflecting anything. Why is it okay for you to mention the money that the evil corporations and such but when I explain the legal right for them to do it, I deflect.
The bottom line is that the unions are spending 10s of millions of dollars for the right to spend 100s of millions more in the future, all without the express permission of those whose money they are taking.

@26 and Mad Mom October 30, 2012 at 9:34 AM

The bottom line of 32. Silences the voice of the middle class union members but corporations still can pay for anything they want. The unions (and it is NOT just teachers but pipe fitters and firefighters etc.) just want not to be silenced. To be on equal footing, although the money behind corporations is much greater. Why should corporations get a say and unions be silenced? Union members are the working class. A yes vote hurts a lot of regular citizens. A no vote hurts no one. Everyone is still allowed to contribute to causes s/he supports through businesses or unions.

@anonymous #6 October 30, 2012 at 9:41 AM

You realize your post doesn’t make any sense right? Obama is a democrat. He is also not insanely for abortion and against marriage. You definitely need to do some reading. Socialist? He is a moderate much closer to Ronald Reagan than the liberals. America won’t survive? You are the one who is insane. Nothing will destroy this country. You should move somewhere else if you have so little faith in the people of America.

Money Spent on Prop 32 October 30, 2012 at 12:17 PM

@27
This is right off the text of the prop 32

http://vig.cdn.sos.ca.gov/2012/general/pdf/text-proposed-laws-v2.pdf#nameddest=prop32
4. Make all employee political contributions by any other means strictly voluntary.

Are saying that the union members unable to make their own contibutions without their union heads doing it for them? It does not “Silences the voice of the middle class union members”, it only makes them responsible for their own choices. If you believe that the union membership is that incabable, maybe you should try to get a prop that would allow the union leadership to cast all their members individual votes for them. I am sure they would relish the opportunity to do so.

@money spent on Prop 32 October 30, 2012 at 1:27 PM

Union members elect their own leadership and are free to vote in other leadership if they don’t like the political causes supported by their union donations. Are you saying union members are not capable of doing that?

Prop 32 does not treat unions and corporations equally. Unions get their money from their members. Corporations get their money from their customers. Prop 32 requires the union to get individual permission from each member to use their money for political causes. It DOES NOT require corporations to get individual permission from each customer to use a portion of their purchase money for political purposes.

Prop 32 is just more right-wing Republican shenanigans. That’s why almost every major newspaper as well as non-partisan good government groups such as the League of Women Voters have come out against it. It’s a fraud.

Anonymous October 30, 2012 at 1:55 PM

#28 You definitely need to do some reading…that was a quote of a message that was left on my voicemail. Not in any way my words, go to the top of the thread and read all the comments.

This surely doesnt make me want to vote republican! Obama is married with children, OBVIOUSLY WHOEVER LEFT THIS MESSAGE isn’t very intelligent and no one needs someone else to think for them. Think for yourselves people. Leave all the BS out of it and look at facts and decide what you believe is the correct choice. Quit being lazy and do your own research.
“I am at shaver. This election is the most important in our lifetime America will not survive another four years of Barack Obama. He will push America into bankruptcy. He is a socialist insanely committed to abortion in the destruction of marriage and there’s no friend of Israel. We need to do everything possible to vote him out of office. I urge you to pray and vote. Every vote will count. Your vote is essential to speak to your friends and neighbors and urge them to vote out Obama”

Chuckie’s Wife October 29, 2012 at 1:11 PM
…. @Anonymous (#6) – who says the message you received was from the Republican party? AND your reasoning is flawed. Romney is also married with children, so if that’s your basis for voting for one candidate or the other…you should vote for Romney – he has more kids.

Anonymous October 29, 2012 at 1:52 PM
#14 my reasoning makes perfect sense “He is a socialist insanely committed to abortion in the destruction of marriage…” Obama is married with children yet he is “insanely committed to abortion and the destruction of marriage” that doesnt make sense!
Never said this was my basis for voting for one or the other, that would be a pretty idiotic basis.

money spent on prop 32 October 30, 2012 at 3:56 PM

@#30
Union leadership is not elected unanimously, so there are those that are disenfranchised when the leadership spends their money without their permission. How often are the leadership elected and whose money is spent on their re-election campaigns. How long do the disenfranchised have to give their money to what they do not want done with it?
To use your analogy, the stockholders of the corporations elect their board of directors every year, but they can also sell their stock if they do not like what the board is doing, union members do not have that option.
46% of America voted for McCain in 2008. Are you saying that 100% of union members voted differently?

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